A Hard Lesson In DIY: Matt Wettergreen & The Dimes
I've been looking forward to Noise and Smoke for quite some time now. Joey and Liz have been busting their balls/ovaries to put together one of the strongest festivals ever in the Houston Indie scene. When someone said "Deerhoof is playing that same night; you can't put on a show that night." Joey responded "Fuck Deerhoof." Now that wasn't a dis to Deerhoof but a dis against suggesting that local bands couldn't compete. That, my friends, is class. I mean look at the line-up?
This is a celebration of the local music scene and any band asked to play it should be glad to participate and be so honoured. Sure, things will happen when doing any festival (I know from first hand experience) and sure enough there have been some hiccups along the way. First, God's Temple of Family Deliverance had to cancel due to a physical injury to drummer Chris Ryan's foot. Then, Walter's (one of the two original venues) was forced to cancel various shows before they got completely run out of business by yuppie neighbors with noise complaints. This forced a last minute change to the historic Axiom which couldn't be more perfect. This kind of stuff, by my book, is pretty par for the course for any festival.
A LAWYER ONCE SAID
NEVER PUT IT IN WRITING
Clearly the effort involved in this festival was not on the mind of the person who authored an e-mail from the HQ of the Dimes [You can read the full e-mail at ADR's excellent Skyline Network]:
We wanted to let you know, personally, that we have decided to drop from the Noise and Smoke show.
It is important to us that you know that this is in no way meant to be a sign of disrespect to you or any of the other bands on the bill. ...we have based our decision on the general mishandling, lack of communication and professionalism surrounding the show. Since the show's inception we have attempted to remain professional ... And despite several offers to play other shows, we felt it was important to remain professional.
However, with the recent developments, there is a strong indication that there has been inadequate preparation and therefore, we no longer feel this show is in our best interest.Again, we want to make clear that this has nothing to do with personal profiteering and is not meant to be a sign of disrespect.
Nigh a week before the show and they drop out! And they have the nerve to complain about being unprofessional? What, so Walter's cancels shows including this one and the organizers move the show? To me that shows that the organizers weren't sitting on their ass, they were hustling to move the show and pulled it off! Kudos to them. We had the same issue in Austin during the Texas Psych Fest. It was a hassle but Scott Telles earned praise for moving (and saving) the show, not ridicule. So let's face it, this is simply an excuse and nothing more to get the band off of a festival that wasn't perceived as benefiting their career.
DIY
What we have here is a good reason for any local band NOT to have a manager. 
It's no news that The Dimes have been under management as of late by some would-be mogul named Matt Wettergreen for some time now and this just shows what an utter asshole that guy is. Wettergreen, who is clearly the author of this second rate "business memo", is just another person who sees his fortune riding on the talent of others and the Dimes are just naive enough and unsure enough in their talents to be ripe for the picking. Can the Dimes book their own shows? Yes. Can they release their own acclaimed EP? Yes. Can they earn the respect and support of their peers? Yes. So why hand over their band to some snake oil salesman? Simple, the lessons of DIY and punk are lost on the band.
I hate to harp on the whole punk rock ethos as I see it but it all comes down to Do It Yourself and Community. I don't mean to sound all preachy but the second you give the reigns to some outsider, it's not your band anymore - it's his. 
Go and read This Band Could be Your Life. That shit went down because people believed in themselves and there was a community there that lifted everyone up. Yes, you sometimes may have to scrabble that community out from nothing but that is your scene and in some way you participated and helped it along.
A manager is something between you and that community. It reduces that interaction to a business transaction, making you a commodity to be sold. A manager like Wettergreen cares little for community. To him and his ilk, you are a product to be marketed for maximum return. If that means shitting on your friends and supporters - hey, it's just business right?
But here is the thing, ironically managers work for bands. Yet, as in this Noise and Smoke fiasco, bands like the Dimes are willing to put aside their better judgment and abdicate to their manager. Here is the problem. Does Wettergreen sign the e-mail with his name? No, he signs it "The Dimes". Perversely, the manager becomes the band. Here the band finally concedes even it's own voice to the manager. Their job has merely become to manufacture a product, shut up, and do as they are told.
So here we are, Liz and Joey have worked hard to prepare a feast with everyone invited to the table and we have a band's manager throw the plate back at them. But this is "professional", "has nothing to do with personal profiteering", and is in no way disrespectful. No, this is that hard-nose business professionalism that John Lomax keeps saying more local bands need - a hard nosed motherfucker like Matt Wettergreen.
Here is the problem for those of us who love music; it's not just a commodity to us. Great music is a smoky bar or on an LP to us is on par with reading Melville, looking at the paint strokes on a Van Gogh, or admiring the joyous madness of Werner Herzog. When a manager comes between the band and its fans and supporters the band becomes something less and we're left wanting that band we loved so much back.
So let this be an object lesson. Do things yourself. Book your shows. Make your own flyers. Record your own record and release it. Never give away your right to think for yourself and do what is best for you. You are smarter and capable of more than you think.
Links:
Ume
The Ka-Nives
Satin Hooks
Bring Back The Guns
Finally Punk
Jana Hunter
Eat Grapes
Cop Wamth
Saturday March 10
Indian Jewelry
Something Fierce
Skullening
The Wiggins
Blades
Sporatics
Credits:
Faust Image from uwm.edu
Really Red Photo by Dixon Coulbourn from Idle Time which has a bunch of old cool Texas punk rock pics..check it out.
89 Comments:
Man, that sounds like a really crappy move by the dimes. and you are absolutely right about those types of profeteers. i think there are a couple of things that drive a lot of bands to them like fish to a worm on a hook. First the apparent overwhelmness of what it takes to be a "successful" band combined with a certain confusion and lack of focus about what that "success" entails. Its easy to see how a band might feel like they need some help in the face of wanting to do all the things bands often want to do. And here's where a lot of the sharks hit the water with promises of "oh you just go ahead and play and i'll take care of the rest". So undestandably these bands need support. They need help finding clubs to play, places to record, mix and master, distribution for their record, a little money management experience also helps, as well as maybe some experience from others that have done those things. And here's where the second reason a lot of bands fall prey to the sharks, and that is that they are not part (or often times are part, but don't realize it) of a community that will support them in all those things they feel they need help with. I'm sure if they looked around them they would have found plenty of people ready to help them book shows and even tours, do artwork, find distribution, studios, sell merch, help with the press, flyers, you name it. I think most us have done one if not most of those things for fellow bands and were happy to do them, becasue ulimately we are all on the same boat, and most of the time there is no need to bring in a captain from somewhere else when all that needs to be done can be done by the hands currently on deck.
So its either that or they are douchebags who think that having a guy with a business card fronting for them will make their music sound better.
Either way, great post. As I've said before, i really dig your point of view.
Something doesn't add up there. It's not clear to me why the Dimes would care if the show was moved. It seems like they just don't want to do the show and were looking for an excuse to pull out. I think it would have made more sense just to say, "Hey, we got a better offer" or even "We just don't want to do the show."
I know Matt Wettergreen and I wouldn't describe him as a hardnosed motherfucker at all. He took over organizing the ktru outdoor show last year after the previous organizer backed out. He did a lot of complaining about how things were botched, but I'm not sure how much of what he said was botched was actually drama. He alienated more than a few people with the things he said, and I'm not even sure he meant to.
So my guess is that's what's going on here. He's making more out of the situation than is there and then other people make more out of his making more and then it's a big monster and suddenly people are looking around wondering where the monster came from.
But what do I know?
Yeah, clearly it's not about the venue change and it's about not wanting to do the show but anyone with an ounce of common sense would have simply lied - a family obligation or something like that - and apologized profusely.
Regardless, the Dimes clearly don't need him and he has no idea what he is doing.
Ramon, shut the hell up!!!!
As far as these guys getting big heads, keep in mind that they are really young and have already received a lot of positive attention (including right here from Ramon and Rosa) so I'd give them a lot of leeway on their 'tude.
Now as for that letter, it is unprofessional and you certainly don't need a manager to write something like that. Keep it simple stupid. Besides if the only reason you want out is because you are nervous that the show might not be managed well...I don't know I'd say stick with it and see. What the hell do you have to lose? In fact you have more to gain by sticking to it. Anyway if the show is a disaster, then the next time the organizers come around you can tell them to piss off.
Even seasoned bands that have been around forever get fucked around by these "sharks". You can't blame the Dimes for falling prey to such people given their relative inexperience. That is if what Ramon says is indeed what is happening. Maybe they really don't want to play and it's actually their decision.
And to Mr. Anonymous.. You shut the fuck up and get a life!! What's with this fuck???
Joseph Malaty.
yeah, it's definitely youth and not big heads. the funny thing that works about the dimes is their sweetness and humility in person coupled with their hard punk sound on stage.
what this fiasco has taught me is that we (and i'm talking about like-minded organizers and what-not) shouldn't ever assume again that the kids know ANYTHING about the punk rock ethic just because they like punk rock music.
funny thing is that i talked to liz and joey about this and, true to form, they just really want for the dimes to make nice-nice (or just to contact them) so that they can put this all behind them because they "love those kids so much."
IF THE DIMES ARE READING THIS HERE IS YOUR PLAN FOR RECOVERY: and this one's free. next time i take 10%. ;)
1. contact the organizers as soon as possible.
2. take FULL responsibility for what happened.
3. take your lumps with grace.
4. attend the show that you flaked on.
this applies to any young band that didn't read the punk rock handbook before bungling a fantastic opportunity.
unfortunately for their manager (who i don't know despite my ktru gig) it's gonna take alot more to get this fiasco off his record.
ok gonna go back and stare at those really red photos!!!
Even seasoned bands that have been around forever get fucked around by these "sharks".
Whoa there. I don't think there are any sharks in the water.
Dear Anon,
Whatevs.
No sharks, but definitely one big leech.
All this reminds me of the guy that managed the Jinkies and how he effectively helped make an otherwise fun night for them and Project Grimm a near total disaster. If memory serves me correctly, the Jinkies were damn near in a fist fight with one another over the way things went down that night. And all because they had this douche manager calling shots for them. He made us take bottom billing on the flier (which in itself was fine) but then he insisted we didn't mention it was our record release (both our bands had already discussed the show before they ran it by Mr. Dickwad) because it might take attention away from them. Which is ridiculous as anyone who was around will attest, because they drew an audience and we really didn't, so the guy was just an asshole. Not a whiny one like me, but an asshole all the same.
This was a bad decision on the part of the Dimes. I mean it isn't the end of the world for them. And as I said in Skyline (is that right?), I don't know all the details, nor do I know what they were thinking, so I can't say too much about this. Suffice to say that someone made a bad decision for somewhat unclear motives, and in the end everyone comes out looking bad. It'll blow over, and if they are half as nice as R&R say they are, they'll do the right thing somehow.
I always gave festivals more thought than regular shows because they always get fucked up so easily. Maybe the Dimes will do the same in the future if they don't like the issues that arise with festivals. Having said that, I have had some seriously good times playing fests, so what do I know?
de Schmog once opened for a nameless Thrill Jockey band at Fitzgerald's. Chris, the Fitz manager at the time, wanted us on the bill because we had a local draw and nobody knew these guys. It was a weeknight and we'd played recently so we weren't expecting a big crowd. But actually a fair amount of people showed up, all our friends and pretty much just the really close friend fans. Anyway this nameless band's manager made us set up in front of their equipment which gave us practically no room at all. And then forced us into a 25 minute set.
Brandon was so frustrated he told the audience that directly after we played there was going to be a party at the de Schmog house. The place cleared out and nobody was there for nameless band. The singer looked upset and apologized to us.
Turns out Tom Bunch was there and he told the Fitz manager that de Schmog would never be a real band.
There's a lesson in there but you have to decide which one it is.
I can't even remember their name because they fell off the face of the earth after that I guess.
Oh god, no, not Tom Bunch.
Yes Tom Bunch you whiny ahole. I love you.
Whatever makes you feel better, K Fed.
What is a real band anyway? I can't figure that one out.
Yeah I feel better. You know it's just...hey wait a minute, quit that.
Anywayy that might not be exactly what he said. It was along the lines of unprofessional which is true.
who was the Jinkies manager?
"Professionalism" is probably the most misused and overrated term in music. Being professional isn't about fucking a popular local band even when you are afriad they might show you up. It isn't about insulting the band to the club management to bolster your already bad reputation either. If you are working in a business, and everyone wants what's best for them, you need to know when to tread light and when to tread heavy. If you have any sense, and a nice solid pair, you can figure that out. A manager is there to do what the band either can't or doesn't want to. You do have to be able to stick up for your cleint, but you don't have to be a total fool just because you are a "manager." Nobody even likes managers, they are a sometimes necessary evil, and good ones know this. You simply can't come to Houston on a weeknight in the 90's and think you can push a band like de schmog around in front of their homecrowd when no one even knows who you are. That, is totally unprofessional. If those fucks played their cards right, they could have gone back to Lexington and sampled the debaucherous pleasures therein instead of tearing Houston from their tour map. It doesn't matter if you like the band or not, you can't act like they owe you a favor because they never do.
Moral: aw fuck it...
Shit, I was afraid you would ask me that. I can't remember his name. I think it might have been Richard Tomcala. If Matthew returns he can tell you.
I hear you John but at the same time our actions weren't of the highest standard either. We killed any chance of hanging out with them just as much by walking out. And didn't really do our own rep very good.
Actually I stayed and they were
b o r i n g.
So there's that.
Working with Tomcala is "working for the man." Wait he is the guy that runs the Richmond Strip band thing isn't he?
Just going off of what you wrote, I would say that taking the party elsewhere, whlie being drastic, was a reasonable outcome of your (or Brandon's anyway) being angry with the Thrill Jockey's less than thrilling jockeying. To be honest, I would have done the same. You know, if we had a large local following, and a house that they would actually come back to, and if we ever held parties, and if... you get the idea.
I'm not sure is Tomcala is that guy or not.
To get back at what I was writing.. Shark is a harsh word, but you always hear about this thing happening. Ramon, did you not manage a band in the early nineties?? Can't you and Rosa guide these guys? The Dimes appear to be young and impressionable.These two elements can spell disaster.
Joseph Malaty
NIce looking post Ramon. And timeless topic.
I remember living at Catal Huyuk/Axiom, and Dick Dale's guy kept calling us trying to intimidate us into letting him play the venue, but we just couldn't justify the door price we would have had to ask, to pay him. So we turned him down... Then, he gets these mafia guys to start calling us and threatening to come down and beat us up if we didn't let him play. Now, that is good business sense. He sure had a cool manager. Now, whenever I hear surf rock I think of broken fingers.
dick dale has heavies. that is so fucking awesome.
guide the dimes? i can barely guide this glass of wine to my lips.
watching rolling stones rock and roll circus on pbs. john lennon singing the blues backed by eric clapton, keith richards, and mitch mitchell on drums. whoa.
taj mahal. double whoa.
Yeah! Talk some more shit about the Dimes! You guys are getting off track! Let those jerks...uh...let 'rm really...aw, hell...I'm no good at this. Sorry, lost my head there for a moment.
Welcome back Matt.
You asshole. : )
I kid of course :P
Alright, alright...as Ricky would say "Okay Lucy...'splain." I'm still around...and peeking in on occasion, it's just that this blog was beginning to remind me of all the reasons that I left Houston in the first place, and I'm starting to realize that I still have never really made peace with my past as an untouchable boy rockstar genius. It's just...we fucking blew it. I mean it. Every time I pick up my li'l
minimum wage paycheck, it's just "Dude, you were in a really popular band, with a lotta big shots expressing a lotta interest...you could've been livin' large like a Puff Daddy video by now." And I blew it, and it fucking hurts, sometimes. Sure, I left for various reasons that probably make sense to outside parties, but it's tough. It really is. So let me explain a few things for ya, if you'll let me.
Do I think John maybe took a cheap shot at me? Yeah, probably, but at the same time, it's not... what Anon or anybody else might not understand is that; in his defense, I don't think he went far enough. He could have said a lot more, and I would've agreed with him. See, the real problem was I WANTED THOSE FUCKERS TO THINK WE WERE IN ZEPPELIN! And they just didn't, really. But that's okay, too. They wanted to be in Big Star or Badfinger, and hey, that's great, I love that as well, but it wasn't me, exactly, anymore than I was right for them. But not in a bad way...it's more like...are you familiar with that Lennon quote where he talks about the Beatles believing that they were the best group in the world, and thinking it is what made it so? I guess I'm trying to be like that...or rather, I was...not so much, anymore.
So is it fair to say that I have a feverish ego? Well, I should certainly hope so. Because often times, my own feelings of self-worth can become dangerously low, so it sort of helps me maintain a degree of implied stability. But to have a big ego like mine...it's sort of like a disease that lies dormant within my own blood cells, and it always seems to have the incredibly bad taste to flair up at the most inappropriate moments. But still, it's what makes me ME, and you can't really have it any other way, can you? Just try to keep the goddamned thing in check, and learn to use it wisely, which is most likely a never ending class that I will never pass. I'll tell ya a quick story, and you can judge for yourself, whether it makes me a jerk, or if you can find a li'l bit of yourself within the words... although at this point one can almost feel dd beginning to slip away. "Oh, for chrissakes...get to the point...Matthew...too much like ON THE ROAD...oh, look...something bright and shiny!"
Once, when I was in a band with Ramon, we played this show at the Vatican, opening up for some big time operator, and I guess that the club liked us enough to ask us to come back the following Saturday, and when we did, there was this young teenage boy who I guess was at the first show, and now he was back, and standing right up front and center...and he was dressed just like me. Rosa just thought it was the cutest thing, and she teased me about it for days on end, and everybody had a big laugh, and I did, too...and, of course when nobody was looking, I just cried my eyes out. I just felt fantastic. Yeah, man...it was about the coolest thing that I ever got out of Rock and Roll and my eyes are welling up just thinking about it, even now. I mean, what in the hell else was I supposed to feel?
Matthew - That might be the most beautiful thing I've read on NAP and I don't even know what the heck to make of it.
The entire idea of "management" is pretty lame anyway, especially at the local level. I always viewed it as being the band's helpmeet, not in the biblical sense. You organize the shows, try to get the most money (or any money at all most of the time), make sure the band actually attends their shows (always a nail biter with certain members), and most importantly, push the band onward. It's a most unecessary position, the "manager". The band can do all of that, if so inclined, and have one less person to talk to on the phone.
I can think of only 2 instances in which a manager can be helpful:
1) When trying to sell yourself to a promoter that has never heard of your band, if you're the humble type it can be a lot easier to have a third party proclaim your rock worthiness as opposed to telling a stranger "Oh yeah, MY band is the best, WE rock the place, etc."
2) When your band wants to get out of an obligation and you're a fucking pussy, the third party can be the bearer of bad news and insulate you from the dismayed looks and untoward comments from the people you just completely screwed.
Hey Matthew, glad to see the dog whisperer didn't get you.
Joseph,
My Managing Dry Nod I think was more of joke than anything else. But I was really just trying to book them shows in Austin and that was clearly a disaster. I think Dry Nod could have fucked it up themselves just a s well without me.
But you do have a point (which Dorothy also brings up) that this may be the bands decision. If so, it was handled badly enough where any good manager would have said buck-up and play the show you babies or written a better letter.
And true enough, perceptions of being the "Opening band" playing on the "weaker" night scheduled against the Deerhoof show were the motivating factors here and at least one band member HAD been heard expressing those concerns.
So yes, there is ego at play here but again any good manager could have pulled out with more grace or put some perspective on the matter. So going back to the Dry Nod thing - I think the Dimes can fuck things up for themselves; they don't need a manager to do it.
Dorothy, Dorothy, Dorothy...
I assume this is the Dorothy that was here in H Town managing the Sugar Shack boys, and the Mike Gunn for a spell too? If so, welcome. You rock, and you were an example of a manager that would never do dumb shit like Mr. Dimes.
And Matthew, I will never stop talking shit about anyone who I think deserves it, which of course includes you, though I still say my jabs were less cruel then certain Irish men and anonymous folk might claim. When you stick your neck out you get cut. I have.
But I'm glad you didn't permanently head for the hills simply for some nonsense I sputtered. So there's room for your ego in here too. MAybe your wind can cut mine a tad.
bow down or curtsy. dorothy is here.
matthew i am so sorry i teased you. i can't really remember the early 90s. i do remember y'all playing a really bad show in front of some record label reps at the vatican. what label was that?
Yes John. It looks like this was something of a catharsis for Matthew so instead of being a pain in the ass it turns out you are a true healer
but Anon gets head nurse credits.
Now someone is going to have to stay up with Matthew for a while. Volunteers? Ladies? Gigs in Brooklyn.
Oh and hugs plus kisses to Dorothy who probably took more heat than was worth it trying to be a band manager in H-town. You'll always be a hero in my book for turning me on to Touch&Go.
Anon gets no credit, there is no anon.
Hey Dorothy!! its been a long long time! remember me?
I suppose ANON could be a regular under an altered state, but I do know it's somebody...'cause it ain't me, babe. Believe it.
Oh, and Rosa-why are you sorry? That was the whole point, it made me feel wonderful.
Another thing I wanted to point out, particularly to Ramon, maybe...I think it's important to remember that the Replacements, the Huskers, even the Stones, Stooges, MC5, and Hendrix had managers...and they all had one before their first record deal, when they were all still local yokels. I like how Dorothy stated that they can be a good thing for people who just don't have the gumption to work out things for themselves, and let's face it...that's just about every musician that has ever existed...especially drummers. Ba Da BOOM!
Another thing...in my own defense: I want to remind everybody that I was sort of the Mick Taylor of the Jinkies (Yeah, right...I WISH)...there was somebody else standing on the right before me, and a different person afterward, so the name, managers, etc., that was already in place. I liked Richard, though. He was a really nice guy, to me, anyways...and he was incredibly supportive, which is nice if that's a new thing in yer life, but he also liked Carolyn Wonderland and the Imperial Monkeys, so admittedly, I did feel reservations...like, does this guy really understand what we want to do, or even sound like? And, yeah...a lotta stuff went down that I thought was real goofy. As far as the record release deal--this is my version: We actually talked about the whole thing, a day or so beforehand, and yes, John's beliefs are right on the money. The people that ran the show just wanted it to say "Jinkies-cd release", and then list the other groups, but without mentioning that Grimm was also putting out a disc that very same day...apparently it was indeed a "steal your thunder" kind of move...Carlos and I both called bullshit, and said no, that was just the sort of thing that will come back and make you look like a complete dick, so put it ALL on the poster. And then we split. When I got to the club, the poster said fuck all about Project Grimm. I stormed through the door...and the dj was playing our record over the sound system. And everybody was acting so goddamn nonchalant about the whole thing....like "don't worry about it", and I just went fucking ballistic. I yelled at the sound guy, told him to can that horrible shit, and play a good record, I yelled at the people that ran the club, the bartenders, bums on the street, the ghost of Jerry Garcia...I was so out of my head. Not because I'm this really great guy who loves the Houston scene and wants to create a environment where we can all make beautiful music together...that's not it, either. I just do not enjoy being painted into the cocksucker corner of the room and those pussies just sat there and took it all in stride, and to this day, I always felt suspect about the whole thing, like what the hell is this all about? It's such a silly thing in hindsight, but it really felt wrong at the time, and it wasn't quite the proverbial straw that broke my back, but it was damn close...a month and a half later, I was gone.
I think my point is, I had suspicions about the venue for our release, and I figured with the connections between both bands, the show was, over my objections, a good idea. Of course, the whole thing went to shit because of the reasons documented by both of us. Our mistake was to think we would get a fair shake in that environment. One thing though, didn't you guys have a big fight within your own band that night? I swear that Rick and Drew came over to me saying that you guys were basically coming to blows out front? I've always thought lines were drawn over the issue within your ranks, which maybe doesn't mesh with your saying that you and Carlos were in agreement. Of course, you would know, you were out there and I wasn't.
God how I don't miss that kind of bullshit.
Yeah, see...that's the whole thing. I was so adamant not to pull that shit...not because I'm a super nice guy or anything, I just thought it was the decent thing to do...you know, it's just an advertisement, what's the big fucking deal? I think people looked at it like "Our Show", and you guys were just guests, and I was thinking of something much more glamorous, like those old Fillmore shows of the 60's where Miles Davis would play with Crazy Horse. You know, we just didn't really sound alike, but it would WORK, but I could tell in the meeting that it was a possible fuck fuck because Richard just sort of kept hemming and hawing about this little stupid thing, but when we left I felt comfortable that I wouldn't look like an ass, and then they went ahead and omitted your info anyway, and like I said, the top of my brain just exploded. See, I have this thing: If my name is connected to dickhead stuff, and it's my fault, then so be it...but if it's implied as me without really being ME, okay, here we fucking go. In all honesty, there were even people there from other bands telling me that it wasn't personal, but just business, and I should stop being so naive and get used to it, and that was it for me, I just came out swinging. I was so close to punching motherfuckers, I couldn't believe it. The thing that really got me was that it was all just "a simple mistake", but I just didn't buy it, and I started looking at Carlos differently, and when you start second guessing your own band member's behaviour, well...that's when the days get shorter and the nights get looooonnng. I'm probably wrong about him, he didn't seem too keen on it either, but they were all so blase, it just really made me wonder. So, we played our li'l show, and I played the solo from "Cinnamon Girl" on every song, and sang out of tune, and then threw my guitar against the wall and fucked someone else's girlfriend, because that's what I do. Admittedly, I turned out to be wrong for them as well, so it's all fine in the end...that's what this is all about, right? You play for awhile, you love each other, you fight each other, and that's that. Hell, Noel Redding left the Jimi Hendrix Experience because HE WANTED TO PLAY THE GUITAR IN HIS OWN BAND...and I don't think anybody can ever accuse me of doing anything that stupid.
I too know Matt Wettergreen and have always known him to be a stand up guy. Why not try talking to him or give him a chance at a reply? He's got a firstnamelastintital-at-rice email address.
Dear Anonymous,
I sent him Wettergreen shot across the bow via e-mail asking something like "Just what the fuck are you thinking?" and "Just what the hell are you doing for the Dimes that they can't do for themselves." He never responded.
But look here are the two possible Wettergreen alternatives:
1) Matt Wettergreen initiated the letter because he's playing mr big shot;This would make him an asshole and an idiot.
2) The Dimes initiated the intent behind the letter and Wettergreen obliged them. Making the Dimes assholes and Wettergreen an idiot.
In either case he's a shitty manager who has no clue what he's doing. The best we could hope for is the latter where at least he wouldn't be an asshole.
So given the options of he's either a and Idiot and an asshole or he's simply an Idiot - No he doesn't get a forum. Fuck him. I'm covering the first night of Noise and smoke next week. Maybe I'd talk about his band next week if he decided to play but tough shit.
Also, ask John and Kilian that was the nice version of the blog. The original version was much more harsh.
true that
Double true.
i third that. it took me a looooooong time to talk him out of blog version 1.0.
well plus if y'all let anyone who NAP writers have publicly humiliated hold court here, we wouldn't see another regular NAP writer until June '08.
can i just reiterate that there is no wrong done in this situation that can't be made right? i mean, to put things in perspective, it's not like anyone became junkies and stole their former bands'/boyfriends' band gear. that was so 2006.
Yes, Rosa,
I think anyone can at some point forgive the Dimes for the letter which is really why there is even an issue - no tacky letter and we'd likely not be talking about this - but they definitely have dropped down a huge notch in my book and my enthusiasm for them has also dropped despite them being a stellar band, generally nice guys, and a band that makes great music. Matthew and I disagree on this but I just abhor the whole rock star thing, It's just so tedious, but with the Dimes it is also so disappointing.
I still love The Dimes because their rock and roll is the shit.
Like R&R, I know the boys personally and have helped them with a few things in the past.
Bottom line, they are good kids who make great music, and made a giant mistake in writing the letter.
Obviously they wanted out of the show and used the venue change as an excuse. That's how nice they are. Meaning, they didn't make up a family conflict/emergency lie, because they aren't the type of guys who would lie. Look for a lame excuse, maybe, but liars no.
Truth is The Dimes are pretty pure. I know their intention and this letter back fired on them in a way that they probably never would have imagined.
Remember, most of us on this blog are probably old enough to be Carlos' or Cley's parents. The boys are too young to not know what they don't know. You know?
Knowing The Dimes, my guess is they wrote the letter. There is a good chance that the manager may have influenced their decision in dropping out of the festival in the first place, but I will bet money that the letter came directly from the band.
In my opinion The Dimes are too young, too nice, and too good (meaning opportunities are gonna come their way)not to have a manager.
They either need a better manager, or they need to LISTEN to their manager on the front end when he tells them NOT to do a show. Of course if their manager advised them not to do the show, they need a new manager.
I think me, Rosa, Heba, and Dorothy should manage The Dimes. 50% for the ladies, and 50% for the boys.
So Dorothy Cape "Cranky" Jackson-Dean, is that really you?
Hey Rhonda,
Nice to see you peek in on this and Yes, I beleive that that WAS in fact The Dorothy.
I'll say no more on the Dimes thing as I've exhausted anything I have to say on the matter. At his point I'm just like whaevs. I'm looking forward to the show and the Dimes will recoup from this at some stage becase they've got the goods.
Degrading words Mr. Medina. I hope Mr.Wettergreen doesn't kick your ass and that it's all talk on his part. I hear he's fuming right now. I'd watch it with the blind insults. Inside word from a reliable source says he's looking for you.
Friend/co-worker of Wettergreen.
LOL
Hilarious!
Thanks anon, I needed that.
Tell him to bring a video camera, I have to see this.
Yeah someone saying they are going to kick my ass is like declaring "I'm going to eat a handful of cotton candy". I mean anyone can do it, so what does it prove.
Nevertheless pretty funny and with a sick dog today, I needed a laugh.
I thought you would appreciate that joke. Mr. Wettergreen bites the big one. I am his co-worker but no friend and he did not threaten you. However, we need to kick his ass.
Mr. Don't want to get fired.
LOL
Nah, no ass kicking need take place. I'm sure he has his good side, you know, whatevs, eh?
But seriously that was pretty frikkin hilarious.
Ramon-
Have you spoken to The Dimes or Matthew Wettergreen?
All I'm gonna say is...
Matthew Wettergreen is solid. Seriously, I love that dude. He is good people. He has done so much for The Proletariat, KTRU, myself, and many many others. I'll make a list! Dare me!
Aw, it was a joke? Dang, I was hoping it was for real, yo! You woulda got the greatest story out of it...to get smacked by some Rock Manager...it's so "Hammer Of The Gods".
agree with shawna. ramon, i think you are being way too critical of this situation and maybe this stems from your lack of success at your age...what, 40? the dimes are young and they have a hot sound and if matthew can guide these kids out of this shitty space city where we all live, then more power to them. this is your blog and your opinion, but let's face it everyone bitching about the dimes are in bands with no chance of any success. my band played with the dimes over 2 years ago and we're friends with them and i applaud them for trying to be more than a DIY houston band. who are you to lambast houston bands? you ain't no lester bangs.
stephen anderson lead singer prick
I disagree. I believe Ramon and his band have had moderate success. I define success as having a steady job, a solid marriage, and making a little extra dough on the side playing in a band that's well known in Houston and perhaps Germany and Italy. That's success in my books. I do agree with the critical insults Ramon always seems to insight on this forum. I'm not sure what he's trying to accomplish by doing this, but that type of behaviour doesn't agree with me either. That "shock" element just doesn't work with me. All it does is piss people off. Nothing positive comes from that type of negativety. Maybe there are some unresolved issues going on. I put some of the responsibily on his napster mates as well as his wife. Obviously someone should tell Ramon to take it down a couple of notches. That is unless it works for his cause in some weird way. But close friends and family of his should try to prevent him from putting his foot in his mouth all the time.
Joseph Malaty
Shawna,
Well as I said earlier I'm sure Matt Wettergreen has his good points here I'm talking specifically of him as a manager and nothing more. If this was entirely his idea that is bad and if this is the band's idea any good manager could have handled it with more grace.
I trust Justin and Shawna on him being a stand up guy overall completely apart from this.
Nevertheless, he and the band played their hand badly. It all goes back to the manner in which they pulled out. That letter was callous and arrogant. No letter and we wouldn't be here.
This has nothing to do with the Dimes music, musicianship, and (barring this event) niceness - all of which I have praised over the last nigh 2 years; this has to do with them through their manager playing rock star. I've no patience for that.
and Stephen anderson...
Stephen,
You ignorant slut : )
See above comment about Wettergreen.
But no this has nothing to do with my band being unsuccessful by your standards - releasing 5 albums in Europe over the last decade, not to mention various singles and comps, a few festivals, and we're getting ready to release an new Lp this summer. More importantly we've been doing this for over a decade and it's still fun to go to the space drink beer shoot the shit and make music. Sure, were clearly dinosaurs in the scene and sure nobody cares what we do here but that doesn't preclude us from praising bands and booking shows with bands we like.
Now as for you talking out your arse. We've played a few shows with the Dimes because we think they are a great band. We've always treated them square with billing, money, and everything else. In fact the last show we did play with them we booked ourselves after them and Gay Marriage because those were the better slots given the all ages show and we wanted people to see those bands. We could have hogged Lori Surfer's multi media (which was somewhat problematic and hobbling along because we overloaded the Porletariat's circuits) but we didn't. We worked hard on a photo shoot and poster just for the other bands on that show because we don't ever see shows as something with a headliner but a full package of great bands. We can do that because we do ask bands we admire like the Dimes to play with us.
Contrary to your view of business is business and if it gets you out of this "shitty" city more power to them. I am still old school about how you treat your friends and supporters. If that's your view then fine, whatevs, more power to you and where that leads you but if that's the case with the dimes and they think they are so great that they can badmouth people who support them maybe they don't need people like me shoving the CD in people's faces saying "These guys are amazing, e-mailing them over and over again to get some copies to sound exchange, and even hassling Lomax to come to my show, skip my band, and just catch the Dimes since we booked them early enough where he'd have no excuse.
More than anything what this is more than anything else is adisappointment. If this was a certain band who I gave shit to last year for their music and stage shtick I wouldn't care but here it's a band I believed in and rallied behind so I DO take it a bit more personally that they would do something so callous and stupid. Those are two qualities not worthy of being supported in this or any other.
Have fun with that business attitude. I'm sure John Lomax (god love him) will be singing Flowers To Hide's praises when you play the to sold out stadiums and quoting you on how other local bands should their music like business professionals.
Me, I'll just stick to being unsuccessful dinosaurs and being my own worst manager.
So in short Stephen, Don't be such a whiny pussy. ; )
Hey Stephen, there's a lot of ways to go after Ramon, but telling him he isn't a success because he isn't selling a million records and getting blown by the Pussycat Dolls , instead of saying that you just don't fit them into your definition of success is a mistake. In case you haven't noticed, everyone defines success more or less for themselves. You couldn't possibly imagine that Linus is trying to go huge playing what they play, do you? I applaud the LP4 for trying to be a DIY local band. I applaud anyone who is doing what they really want to do. You should too. I think you're being a little too narrow minded about this. And I hate to tell you this, but you may in fact turn 40 yourself one day. Sorry.
Joseph,
Thanks but I hate to break it to you but as I said earlier. This is the nice and positive version. See a few comments back from Rosa, Kilian, and John. And yes, the anonymous person's comment last week and Rosa did have a big part in me taking it down a lot of notches but it's hard to be critical of bad behavior and not sound like a preachy whiny asshole. But the thing is I stand behind the fact that the Dimes fucked up royally and they and their manager need to put on their humility hats.
Any band that's been together putting out records and playing shows for 10+ years is the peak of success in my book, regardless of how many records they sell or who goes to their shows. If you are enjoying playing and recording and its been 10 years, you made it. Everything else (fame, fortune, groupies, managers) is just frosting on the cake. The Dimes have been around for how long? 2, 3 years? I hate to say it, but as great as their music might be, or how nice they might be, or how many labels might be interested, or how good or bad of a manager they might have, the odds are against them staying together much longer. It just doesn't happen. And more than wishing them a career filled with fame, fortune, groupies, and managers, i wish for them that they are still together in 10 years happily making music together. That kind of success is the real shit.
And if you are not Doing It Yourself, you are probably having it Done To You. DIY doesn't mean you can't have a label, or you can't tour, or you can't have a manager, or an agent or a booker, or a merch guy, or a distributor or none of those things, the Y in DIY can be defined to include all those people. Its all a matter of who those people are and how its done. And treating each other like strangers is not the way to make people feel like part of a team.
Joseph Malaky said:
"I put some of the responsibily on his napster mates as well as his wife."
I can't even get him to stop saying "nigh" and you think i can tell him to not vehemently express his opinion? what am i his mommy?
oh and ramon isn't into "shock" value. that's really the way he talks. trust me the man i'm with now is a kinder gentler ramon than the one who's life was constantly being threatened (because of his mouth) seventeen years ago when we first started dating. lester bangs indeed.
btw i wrote a very positive review of The Dimes cd here in this forum a few months ago. and i've been shooting them for about a year and a half. and they are my friends and we've broken bread together. but i'm not their mommy either.
right on, carlos. can you believe we even have to defend the punk ethos? the more i think about it the more disheartened i become...:(
Hey, Ramon...
You mean to tell me that I'm not going to get the money, drugs and groupies you've been promising me for the last 13 years? All that work was for NOTHING?
Fuck this. I QUIT!
Sorry Clinton,
Flowers to Hide took them all.
Hey, and since we are talking about rewards Ramon has offered... what happened with the Celine Dion joke contest...
Celine's Agent wouldn't talk to me/us after your very public break-up with Ms Dion.
Celine didn't stand a chance against Ms. Anaconda.
I got to say I'm glad there's folks out here sticking up for the Dimes and even this manager dude. Being ignored is way worse than being hated.
Someone's got a quote out there "if at first you don't succeed you failed" but that ain't true, especially as young as those guys are. If you succeed by any standard you will fail often. I just wish the Dimes had failed by playing a shitty show rather than copping out of one (and I'm not really saying the show is shitty).
Anyway don't listen to Ramon he's over thirty.
But someday most of you yungins will wish you were as much of a loser as Ramon. I do.
Steven and everyone else,
You know what in rereading my blog Iv'e come to one conclusion.
My blog puts too much of the blame on the manager. Yes, he should know better (if he's a good manager) to not pen such a stupid letter but the more I think about it the Dimes are ultimately responsible and I was too kind and pulled too many punches by not letting the buck stop with them.
As for anyone who thinks that the letter was appropriate, professional, and worthy being proud of, you are just another rock-star asshole.
You "broke bread" together? Oh, my lord...
Yeah we did a photo shoot with them and the Kimonos and we had snacks prepared for the bands while we waited for everyone to arrive.
Gawd we are such assholes.
is broke bread not the term? i had a lovely dinner at la tapatia with them. they gave me a laundry list of films to watch. they are good, good souls.
"Broke Bread" works. It makes Ramon and Rosa out to be either the unisex Jesus or the Texas Mafia. Either way I'm going to stay on their good side.